Downtown Davis
December 4th, 2007 . 8:05 am . By: Buzz CarrickSteve Davis once again sums up something I’ve been saying for years. When Lamar Hunt took over FC Dallas it saved the team from being closed down. He was willing to do so because he felt he could get a stadium deal in one of the many suburbs of Dallas. Saving FCD is something that I will always respect and thank him for. Add to that his personal investment to make Pizza Hut Park a fantastic, ground breaking facility. BUT… It’s in the wrong place. As wonderful as it is, Pizza Hut Park should have been downtown, it needed to be down town. Dallas as a soccer market has always been two pronged with both the Anglo market and the Hispanic market. I think we all know that the Hispanic market feels betrayed by the move to such a far flung location. No need to beat that dead horse again. Davis makes an another great point about the nature of culture and the urban climate. The great fan bases of the world (and MLS) are in urban soccer stadiums that start and grow in the heart of the city. Many of them have since moved to 80,000 seat massive NFL like stadiums in the burbs. But the started in small stadiums in the middle of neighborhoods. Over the next decade Dallas is expected to have a reverse “white flight” effect as young people move back down town. Have you not seen the boom in urban housing in Dallas? Yes, Frisco is going to grow, but it’s suburban families, which as Davis points out, is the wrong market. Now there is an upside to the burbs, FCD generates tons of revenue from the stage and music venue. You also can’t underestimate the economic value to FCD off all those training fields and the clubs, tournament, and events it supports. The international deals FCD has are a direct result of the facility. The value PHP generates on multiple levels is what keeps FCD in the black and functioning as a business. But which would you prefer, another couple decades of mid level attendance and profit in the Lilly white suburbs, or packed out atmosphere that Toronto and Houston have in an urban setting with perhaps continued losses? Well the packed out stadium of course. Easy for me to spend the Hunt’s money for them eh? I am sure Clark will wonder when my donation check will be in the mail. It’s kinda a moot point anyway as there isn’t much that can be done about it. FCD has a twenty year lease at PHP (or it was 20, less now). But I have a dream and that dream is to be set up facility wide like Real Madrid. Fantastic club facility, practice fields, offices, and training grounds; plus a beautiful down town urban stadium for games in packed out crowds. Can it be done? I can dream right? 16 Comments Comments RSS TrackBack Identifier URI Leave a comment |
It is a shame and a conundrum.
I completely understand the reason for PHP - all of the surrounding retail makes it profitable. All of the surrounding land (practice fields) continues to appreciate in value. It was, for HSG, a no-brainer.
This model saved soccer in dallas. Of course, I went from a season ticket holder to a twice a year fan due to the location. I never once went to Southlake.
I would love to see a soccer stadium near the Cedars rail stop - or in north Oak Cliff.
Hell, I would love an inferno that got rowdy and rude again, but that Inferno only existed at the Cotton Bowl.
But I ain’t got a few million to spend, and The Krafts, Hunts and Anschutzes, much as I love them for fielding teams at all, have no ties to “Urban” environments.
Celtic just built a new practice facility far from Celtic Park. I could certainly see a model where FCD uses PHP for training, some friendly games, etc, but uses a larger stadium that is more centrally located near the fan base. Considering FCD needs all those extras (concerts, tournaments, etc) in order to be profitable.
Of course, in Europe no one parks at the stadium, they have rail lines going everywhere. The main reason the Stars are able to sell the ticket numbers they do is the enormous number of people who take the DART downtown. But historically, neighborhoods similar to Frisco have rejected light rail vehemently, as they feel it brings in those who might taint their perfect little community.
Build it and they will come…..no?
Bring in a solid Mexican Nat. and it will definitely help.
Omar Bravo anyone?
So, there’s bout 17 years left on the lease. No way we’ll get a rail line up there by then. And Robin could be right. Borghetti would be the obvious choice.
I agree, once again Steve Davis nails it square on the head. Even if HSG couldn’t afford (i.e. get a deal for) a downtown or some location closer to the city center, they should have at least tried for a location that was at least _close_ to a rail station.
But as long as we’re dreaming, what are the chances of razing the Cotton Bowl and building a new SSS on its site (and keeping the PHP complex for training, et al as mentioned by others). I mean really, the city of Dallas can’t be serious about spending money to maintain that dump after 2010 (when the Cotton Bowl game moves) just for the UT-OU game, when even that matchup is in doubt on how long it will remain there.
There is this nice piece of land just about 4 miles west of downtown Dallas.
It’s located next to the I-30/Dallas Fort Worth Turnpike when you pass N. Westmoreland Rd.
If you look up Quality Logistics Systems
on google maps in the Dallas area, you’ll see a wooded area with a couple warehouses in front of it. Might be to many trees to clear out.
Although a lot closer than Frisco.
Sonny, are you putting us on?
That parcel, at the the intersection of Westmorland and Singleton is the RSR lead smelter superfund site.
I can assure you the last thing HSG wants is to acquire an interest in a toxic waste site.
The stadium location is not the problem. It’s the marketing of the team that is the problem. Although I’m not convinced that HSG perceives the “chucky cheese” atmosphere at PHP to be a problem.
When FC Dallas decided to move to frisco was there a clause that states there could be no other MLS team within a certain amount of miles? L.A. has two teams…. America was at one time looking to put a mls team together….. And with the hispanic fan base in Dallas….. Hmmmm makes you think and some scared huh? Now i’ll buy that ticket and i’m sure 15,000 fans would too!!!
If we follow his logic than the Dallas Cowboys are doom for not building their staduim Dowtown at fair park. Let’s see if peole will travel to the burbs in Arlington
Bob, that’s backward and doesn’t follow the logic. The Cowboys are like real Madrid. A well established team that can put their stadium anywhere.
The logic above says a new team, like FCD, trying to build hype, coolness, crowds, audience, and a vibe needs to be down in thh urban setting.
Ya know, as a father of a fairly young boy, I plan to bring him to FCD games (he’s still too young for it, but maybe in ‘09). I think I want to take him because I have such fond memories of attending FCD (okay, Burn) games at the cotton bowl back hen I was in my 20s, childless, and living in the city (i still live in the city, but you understand the demographic I’m describing).
I have no desire to take my kid to Rangers, Stars or Cowboy games. Not that I don;t like those sports, I do (well not hockey - soccer is not meant for the ice) it’s that I do not have the FAN connection the visceral enjoyment of the live event. Why? Because I never ENJOYED those those games when I was in my 20s. The Pokes were NFL live and with all the time out for TV, that is a really fucking boring experience. Sorry for the expletive, but no other adjective could do a live NFL game justice. (I’ve been offered free, box seats for the Cowboys and turned it down for no reason other than those fcking TV timeouts).
Point being, for a growing sport, it’s really the 18-30 demographic that matters - old farts like me are either hooked or not. I was hooked by Eck, Dodd, and Farrer. I’m a lifer now, and when my kid is old enough, he will be too.
I think Frisco does not preclude FCD from reaching the 18-30 demo, they just need to work hard to get it. And the inferno becoming hard again would be a good start.
The AAC was barely approved (back room agreements?), and look what that is doing to downtown (huge success plus has spurred much new construction). Unfortunately for the non-AAC teams like the Cowboys and FCD, we were looking for a stadium at the exact time Laura Miller moved into her job as Do Nothing Mayor. Nothing was ever going to happen with her in charge - so blame the people who voted her in. The whole thing disgusts me. I hate Arlington and still feel the Rangers being out there is a joke. When will Dallas get a baseball team? Oh, and have fun at the Red River Shootout at Jerry World…
Agree about Sea Hag Miller. Should have razed Reunion and built it there. Dallas passed on the Rangers, Cowboys, Burn, the horse track and the race track. Came close to losing Mavs and Stars.
[...] small town, but it’s miles and miles to far north. FCD’s stadium should have been downtown in an urban setting (read the post linked for a more in depth discussion of why). The Dallas fan base used to be part [...]